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locked Thoughts on Zeiss High Sped 1.4 ?

André Moncaio
 

Hi All! 
Anyone have thoughts on the Zeiss High Speed 1.4 ?
This lens have been offered to me for a project but I never have used it.
Some friends have told me that is best to use at T4 or T5.6, if full open ou sttoped down they loose definition.
Thanks!

André Moncaio
DoP
São Paulo / Brazil

Raphael Varandas
 

Hey Andre, they are known by the name of B-Speeds, particularly famous for the triangular bouquet.

Original made in arri std mount.

The both extremes of the iris is too soft.

Beautifull flares to me, at 4 you probably start to find some definition ;)

Cheers

Raphael Varandas
Image Enthusiast
SP Brasil

On Mon, 27 Aug 2018 at 23:50 André Moncaio <amoncaio@...> wrote:
Hi All! 
Anyone have thoughts on the Zeiss High Speed 1.4 ?
This lens have been offered to me for a project but I never have used it.
Some friends have told me that is best to use at T4 or T5.6, if full open ou sttoped down they loose definition.
Thanks!

André Moncaio
DoP
São Paulo / Brazil

--

Shane Daly
 

On Mon, Aug 27, 2018 at 07:50 PM, André Moncaio wrote:
Hi All! 
Anyone have thoughts on the Zeiss High Speed 1.4 ?
This lens have been offered to me for a project but I never have used it.
Some friends have told me that is best to use at T4 or T5.6, if full open ou sttoped down they loose definition.
Thanks!
 
André Moncaio
DoP
São Paulo / Brazil

 Hi Andre

If you project them you’ll see the MTF collapse around T2/2.8, a good set will be pretty sharp closed on 4 or deeper. The difference from T2 to Joan is shocking! So your resolution will vary as a result but it’s also a smart way to control your image sharpness. Lol Crawley, BSC loves them particularly for their softness I believe. Compare with Master Primes which are optimized at Joan and see the difference!

Good luck and good light on your show.

Cheers

Shane Daly
LA DP

Jeff Kreines
 

Shane:

I’ve never heard the term “Joan” as applied to lenses. Does it have anything to do with shooting under candlelight, e.g. Joan of Arc?

Jeff Kreines
Kinetta
jeff@...
kinetta.com

Sent from iPhone.

On Aug 27, 2018, at 10:16 PM, shanedaly via Cml.News <shanedaly=me.com@...> wrote:

The difference from T2 to Joan is shocking!

Jay Holben
 

It all depends on what you need/want. Zeiss high speed lenses have a very different look wide open. It's creamier, more veiling glare, significantly less contrast and resolution. It's a very distinct look and there's nothing good or bad about it. As you stop down the lens (as do all lenses) picks up more contrast, resolution and less veiling glare. This happens quickly, at 2/2.8 - you don't have to go to a 4. If you're looking for fast high contrast, high resolution - these are not a good choice. If you want a more "vintage" look, then these are great wide open. There's nothing or wrong, so ignore the people who tell you something like "you can't use them at blah, blah" - they're extremely limited in their understanding of optics and choices. 

So - what kind of look are you going for? We can offer a lot stronger advice if we know that. 

All the best,

Jay Holben
Director/Producer
Co-chair, Lens Committee, ASC Motion Imaging Technology Council 
Los Angeles, CA

Sent from my Atari 2600. Don't judge.

On Aug 27, 2018, at 11:04 AM, André Moncaio <amoncaio@...> wrote:

Hi All! 
Anyone have thoughts on the Zeiss High Speed 1.4 ?
This lens have been offered to me for a project but I never have used it.
Some friends have told me that is best to use at T4 or T5.6, if full open ou sttoped down they loose definition.
Thanks!

André Moncaio
DoP
São Paulo / Brazil

Jay Holben
 

Yeah - Raphael brings up a good point - the T1.4 Super Speeds are known as "B" speed and feature a 9-bladed reuleaux triangle-shaped aperture. That means that the bokeh behind the point of focus is an upright triangle and in front of the point of focus is an upside down triangle. It's a very distinctive look. The T1.3 Super Speeds have a more traditional heptagon (7-bladed) iris so the triangle isn't a factor. These come in a variety of different versions with Mk 3 being the "newest" (about 1995) . The 1.3 Super Speeds are a slightly improved optical design over the "B" speeds, also.


Jay Holben
Director/Producer
Co-Chair, Lens Committee, ASC Motion Imaging Technology Council
Adakin Productions
Los Angeles, CA
www.jayholben.com
Instagram @jayholben

On 8/27/2018 7:56 PM, Raphael Varandas wrote:
Hey Andre, they are known by the name of B-Speeds, particularly famous for the triangular bouquet.

Original made in arri std mount.

The both extremes of the iris is too soft.

Beautifull flares to me, at 4 you probably start to find some definition ;)

Cheers

Raphael Varandas
Image Enthusiast
SP Brasil

Argyris_Theos_cml
 

You cannot match their boqué with any other lens: their triangular aperture makes them unique. Some love them, some hate them.

I hope the attached images pass through

Shot on a Sony F3 between T1.4 and 1.8 with loooots of ND’s (3 filter stack) that certainly reduce resolution even further.

Best

 

Argyris Theos, gsc

DoP

Athens Greece

+306944725315

skype Argyris.Theos

www.vimeo.com/argyristheos

 

From: cml-glass@... [mailto:cml-glass@...] On Behalf Of Jay Holben
Sent: Tuesday, August 28, 2018 7:42 AM
To: cml-glass@...
Subject: Re: [cml-glass] Thoughts on Zeiss High Sped 1.4 ?

 

Yeah - Raphael brings up a good point - the T1.4 Super Speeds are known as "B" speed and feature a 9-bladed reuleaux triangle-shaped aperture. That means that the bokeh behind the point of focus is an upright triangle and in front of the point of focus is an upside down triangle. It's a very distinctive look. The T1.3 Super Speeds have a more traditional heptagon (7-bladed) iris so the triangle isn't a factor. These come in a variety of different versions with Mk 3 being the "newest" (about 1995) . The 1.3 Super Speeds are a slightly improved optical design over the "B" speeds, also.

Jay Holben
Director/Producer
Co-Chair, Lens Committee, ASC Motion Imaging Technology Council
Adakin Productions
Los Angeles, CA
www.jayholben.com
Instagram @jayholben

On 8/27/2018 7:56 PM, Raphael Varandas wrote:

Hey Andre, they are known by the name of B-Speeds, particularly famous for the triangular bouquet.

 

Original made in arri std mount.

 

The both extremes of the iris is too soft.

 

Beautifull flares to me, at 4 you probably start to find some definition ;)

 

Cheers

 

Raphael Varandas

Image Enthusiast

SP Brasil

 

 

Geoff Boyle
 

It’s a very UK term and is err, not PC 😊

 

Refers to an actress.

 

cheers
Geoff Boyle NSC
EU based cinematographer
+31 637155076

www.gboyle.nl

www.cinematography.net

 

 

From: cml-glass@... <cml-glass@...> On Behalf Of Jeff Kreines
Sent: 28 August 2018 06:19
To: cml-glass@...
Subject: Re: [cml-glass] Thoughts on Zeiss High Sped 1.4 ?

 

Shane:

I’ve never heard the term “Joan” as applied to lenses. Does it have anything to do with shooting under candlelight, e.g. Joan of Arc?

Jeff Kreines
Kinetta
jeff@...
kinetta.com

Sent from iPhone.

On Aug 27, 2018, at 10:16 PM, shanedaly via Cml.News <shanedaly=me.com@...> wrote:

The difference from T2 to Joan is shocking!

Shane Daly
 

Hi Jeff

It’s a British term I learnt on set almost 30 years ago, Joan Collins, it’s short for wide open. :)

Cheers

Shane Daly
LA DP

Graham Futerfas
 

As a young DP, I shot with the Zeiss Super Speed 1.4’s wide open in a low-light scene (on 35mm film), and vowed never again. They really won’t get sharp at that stop, and even if they do, the DOF is too shallow to really work for your AC.

I recommend at least stopping down to T/2.4.

Best,
-Graham



---
Graham Futerfas
Director of Photography
Los Angeles, CA
www.GFuterfas.com
---

Shane Daly
 

Was my reply and explanation blocked?! If that's the case with a term as harmless, widely used (I first heard it in 1989 London, many times since including again last week in fact) and frankly humorous as "Joan" then the PC brigade really have taken over the asylum!! Speaking as a left of Bernie proud Liberal. I fully stand against any terms intended to cause harm to anyone, this one was always an affectionate nod I thought. Let's sanitize the entire industry and kill all it's character and history.

Slang such as "Joan" is part of on set dialogue, nothing more to see here. Move along, move along. <sigh>

Shane "often shoots Joan" Daly
LA DP

Geoff Boyle
 

It’s OK, it’s not the PC brigade, just the natural process of your first messages to a list going through the appro process.

 

This was from before Joan’s Dynasty days when she did a number of sexploitation movies.

 

Contrary to popular belief she’s a lovely lady to work with, well she is for the camera crew as she’s very aware who can make her look good/bad. Producers/Directors on the other hand…

 

cheers
Geoff Boyle NSC
EU based cinematographer
+31 637155076

www.gboyle.nl

www.cinematography.net

 

 

From: cml-glass@... <cml-glass@...> On Behalf Of shanedaly via Cml.News
Sent: 28 August 2018 08:25
To: cml-glass@...
Subject: Re: [cml-glass] Thoughts on Zeiss High Sped 1.4 ?

 

Was my reply and explanation blocked?! If that's the case with a term as harmless, widely used (I first heard it in 1989 London, many times since including again last week in fact) and frankly humorous as "Joan" then the PC brigade really have taken over the asylum!! Speaking as a left of Bernie proud Liberal. I fully stand against any terms intended to cause harm to anyone, this one was always an affectionate nod I thought. Let's sanitize the entire industry and kill all it's character and history.

Slang such as "Joan" is part of on set dialogue, nothing more to see here. Move along, move along. <sigh>

Shane "often shoots Joan" Daly
LA DP

Mark Sasahara
 
Edited

We all have regrets, Shane. We all have regrets.
 
Just be glad you didn't get Pfis - Nevermind!
 
Mark Sasahara, DP, NYCeasing to exist, after this post.
Mark Sasahara
  marksasahara@...
   718-440-1013
    http://msasahara.com

Geoff Boyle
 
Edited

We all make mistakes at times, a public posting of a private message being one 😊

 

It’s all in the CML rules and guidelines that nobody ever reads.

 

I know Shane has done his best to remove any trace of this message.

 

Onwards and upwards, please don’t post how offended you are.

 

Lets just let a mistake die a natural death.

 

cheers
Geoff Boyle NSC
EU based cinematographer
+31 637155076

www.gboyle.nl

www.cinematography.net