Topics

Kinefinity

Geoff Boyle
 

Has anyone graded these cameras?

Just use logC they said, yeah right, it looks like shit.

I can get in and poke around and get something reasonable but thats got to be done shot by shot.

It's frustrating as hell.

Geoff
Lost in testing limbo

sid firstframe.com
 

I know Philip Bloom has shot with and graded these rogue cameras - which look good on paper and easy on your wallet.
Sid

SID LEVIN, Film+Edit
FirstFrame, Inc.
978.501.0488


From: cml-post-vfx-aces@... <cml-post-vfx-aces@...> on behalf of Geoff Boyle <geoff@...>
Sent: Monday, July 16, 2018 1:54:52 PM
To: cml-post-vfx-aces@...
Subject: [cml-post-vfx-aces] Kinefinity
 
Has anyone graded these cameras?

Just use logC they said, yeah right, it looks like shit.

I can get in and poke around and get something reasonable but thats got to be done shot by shot.

It's frustrating as hell.

Geoff
Lost in testing limbo

Colin Elves
 

Yeah. There’s a specific KC_Neutral LUT that’s usually a good start. But I’m not sure if the MAVO has new colour science or not - and I didn’t bother grading Bloom’s material as it looked kinda meh anyway.

Best place would be to ask on the Kinefinity Facebook group. I’ll do that for you and forward you the info, since I know you’re busy! 

Colin Elves
Director of Photography
Currently Berlin.



From: cml-post-vfx-aces@... <cml-post-vfx-aces@...> on behalf of Geoff Boyle <geoff@...>
Sent: Monday, July 16, 2018 1:54:52 PM
To: cml-post-vfx-aces@...
Subject: [cml-post-vfx-aces] Kinefinity
 
Has anyone graded these cameras?

Just use logC they said, yeah right, it looks like shit.

I can get in and poke around and get something reasonable but thats got to be done shot by shot.

It's frustrating as hell.

Geoff
Lost in testing limbo

Colin Elves
 

Right! I’ve got some answers....

Both the Terra 4K and the Mavo have specific LUTs, the Terra 4K one is called KC_NEUT4K - and can be downloaded from Dropbox here: https://www.dropbox.com/s/b9vvii2rre9u6n0/KC_NEUT4K.cube?dl=0

The Mavo one is called something like KC_NEUTM and apparently should’ve been in the folder the clips were recorded in - but I’m going to trying to get a copy to send  anyway.

Colin Elves
Director of Photography
Currently Berlin


 
Has anyone graded these cameras?

Just use logC they said, yeah right, it looks like shit.

I can get in and poke around and get something reasonable but thats got to be done shot by shot.

It's frustrating as hell.

Geoff
Lost in testing limbo

Nick Shaw
 

On 16 Jul 2018, at 22:44, Colin Elves <colin@...> wrote:

Both the Terra 4K and the Mavo have specific LUTs, the Terra 4K one is called KC_NEUT4K - and can be downloaded from Dropbox here: https://www.dropbox.com/s/b9vvii2rre9u6n0/KC_NEUT4K.cube?dl=0

These may be useful to make the image "look decent", but for a fair comparison with the other cameras, what is really needed is an ACES IDT for the camera, not a LUT which a manufacturer has created by some unspecified process to make their camera look its best.

Do Kinefinity publish any colorimetry data on their cameras?

Nick Shaw
Workflow Consultant
Antler Post
Suite 87
30 Red Lion Street
Richmond
Surrey TW9 1RB
UK

+44 (0)7778 217 555

Colin Elves
 

Not that I’m aware of. I don’t believe there is an IDT either.

Colin Elves
Director of Photography
Currently Berlin



On 16 Jul 2018, at 23:59, Nick Shaw <nick@...> wrote:

On 16 Jul 2018, at 22:44, Colin Elves <colin@...> wrote:

Both the Terra 4K and the Mavo have specific LUTs, the Terra 4K one is called KC_NEUT4K - and can be downloaded from Dropbox here: https://www.dropbox.com/s/b9vvii2rre9u6n0/KC_NEUT4K.cube?dl=0

These may be useful to make the image "look decent", but for a fair comparison with the other cameras, what is really needed is an ACES IDT for the camera, not a LUT which a manufacturer has created by some unspecified process to make their camera look its best.

Do Kinefinity publish any colorimetry data on their cameras?

Geoff Boyle
 

There is no IDT, I’m trying to help with that, and the Kinelog files I can find well…

 

Cheers

 

Geoff Boyle NSC FBKS

Cinematographer

Netherlands

www.gboyle.nl

 

From: cml-post-vfx-aces@... <cml-post-vfx-aces@...> On Behalf Of Colin Elves
Sent: 17 July 2018 00:10
To: cml-post-vfx-aces@...
Subject: Re: [cml-post-vfx-aces] Kinefinity

 

Not that I’m aware of. I don’t believe there is an IDT either.

Colin Elves

Director of Photography

Currently Berlin

 

 


On 16 Jul 2018, at 23:59, Nick Shaw <nick@...> wrote:

On 16 Jul 2018, at 22:44, Colin Elves <colin@...> wrote:



Both the Terra 4K and the Mavo have specific LUTs, the Terra 4K one is called KC_NEUT4K - and can be downloaded from Dropbox here: https://www.dropbox.com/s/b9vvii2rre9u6n0/KC_NEUT4K.cube?dl=0

 

These may be useful to make the image "look decent", but for a fair comparison with the other cameras, what is really needed is an ACES IDT for the camera, not a LUT which a manufacturer has created by some unspecified process to make their camera look its best.

 

Do Kinefinity publish any colorimetry data on their cameras?

 

Geoff Boyle
 

I’ve downloaded 3 different LUTs that are Kine LUTs, I’ve tried the recommendation I found on LiftGammaGain to use Sony Slog2 and that’s closest but they all look crap.

 

I can tweak and tweak and get a reasonable image but is it what the manufacturer intended?

 

I’m not going to upload any graded material that I don’t think is easily repeatable.

 

I only have one other camera that doesn’t have an IDT and in that case I went to the manufacturers website and downloaded a LUT that works, bang! Just like that.

 

I will be uploading the raw kine files and you can all try 😊

 

Cheers

 

Geoff Boyle NSC FBKS

Cinematographer

Netherlands

www.gboyle.nl

 

 

Billy McCreary
 

Is it their raw files?

bMac

DP | EDIT | VFX | TAMPA

http://bmac.me

Sent from MiPhone

On Jul 16, 2018, at 1:54 PM, Geoff Boyle <geoff@...> wrote:

Has anyone graded these cameras?

Just use logC they said, yeah right, it looks like shit.

I can get in and poke around and get something reasonable but thats got to be done shot by shot.

It's frustrating as hell.

Geoff
Lost in testing limbo

Geoff Boyle
 

cDNG because we thought it would be easier 😊

 

Cheers

 

Geoff Boyle NSC FBKS

Cinematographer

Netherlands

www.gboyle.nl

 

From: cml-post-vfx-aces@... <cml-post-vfx-aces@...> On Behalf Of Billy McCreary via Cml.News
Sent: 16 July 2018 23:34
To: cml-post-vfx-aces@...
Subject: Re: [cml-post-vfx-aces] Kinefinity

 

Is it their raw files?

bMac



DP | EDIT | VFX | TAMPA


http://bmac.me



Sent from MiPhone


On Jul 16, 2018, at 1:54 PM, Geoff Boyle <geoff@...> wrote:

Has anyone graded these cameras?

Just use logC they said, yeah right, it looks like shit.

I can get in and poke around and get something reasonable but thats got to be done shot by shot.

It's frustrating as hell.

Geoff
Lost in testing limbo

Nick Shaw
 

In theory, a cDNG with the correct metadata in it should effectively contain its own IDT. 

If you can post a single DNG I can take a look at the metadata. 

Nick Shaw
Workflow Consultant 
Antler Post
UK 


On 17 Jul 2018, at 08:38, Geoff Boyle <geoff.cml@...> wrote:

cDNG because we thought it would be easier 😊

Nicolas Billy
 

Last year I did a camera test and comparison with RED Dragon, Alexa, and Kinefinity for an upcoming project.
When I was displaying all three camera Raw footage on our big screen, it appeared the Kinefinity footage quality was coming far behind the others Cam. In low light the footage was getting noisy really fast and the colors wasn’t reproducing as good as the others cam.
The producer quickly pull out the option to shoot with the Kinefinity.


Nicolas Billy
+60 1123326390
Showreel
Website
Linkedin











On Jul 17, 2018, at 5:34 AM, Billy McCreary via Cml.News <bmacmail=icloud.com@...> wrote:

Is it their raw files?

bMac

DP | EDIT | VFX | TAMPA

http://bmac.me

Sent from MiPhone

On Jul 16, 2018, at 1:54 PM, Geoff Boyle <geoff@...> wrote:

Has anyone graded these cameras?

Just use logC they said, yeah right, it looks like shit.

I can get in and poke around and get something reasonable but thats got to be done shot by shot.

It's frustrating as hell.

Geoff
Lost in testing limbo

Virgil Kastrup
 

Here I am again promoting scratch. You'd think I work for assimilate, but I do not.
There is an IDT for kinefinity KineLog included with scratch. Don't know if it is any good for the new Kinefinity cameras.



On Tue, Jul 17, 2018 at 4:16 AM Billy McCreary via Cml.News <bmacmail=icloud.com@...> wrote:
Is it their raw files?

bMac

DP | EDIT | VFX | TAMPA

http://bmac.me

Sent from MiPhone

On Jul 16, 2018, at 1:54 PM, Geoff Boyle <geoff@...> wrote:

Has anyone graded these cameras?

Just use logC they said, yeah right, it looks like shit.

I can get in and poke around and get something reasonable but thats got to be done shot by shot.

It's frustrating as hell.

Geoff
Lost in testing limbo



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Virgil Kastrup
post production supervisor
Denmark

+45 28181579

Art Adams
 

I'm looking at the Kinefinity website to see what the camera's "look" is, and it reminds me of two-strip Technicolor. The reds don't feel right... they're either orange or blueish, blues are consistently cyan, and warm hues seem to wash together. A lot of subtle hues turn to mush, and the only primary color it seems to do well is green—and that green is so saturated that it leaps out against all the other muddy hues.

It reminds me of early Blackmagic footage, only a lot worse. Either they are working with a severely compromised sensor, or their color science is in its very early stages, or both.

--
Art Adams
Director of Photography
San Francisco Bay Area