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Digital Cinema Society tests of Blackmagic URSA Mini Pro 12K
The Digital Cinema Society has posted test material shot with the Blackmagic URSA Mini Pro 12K camera. Along with an essay from our monthly eNewsletter, it is designed to to look at the challenges and potential benefits of shooting 12K. The tests were shot with a volunteer skeleton crew over two half days during the pandemic, (so be kind.) Please note that the closeups in the interview setup and the bar scene are digital zooms from the 12K master shot, and that the Chinatown sidewalk and tunnel shots were highly stabilized, which would not have been possible without the extra resolution.
Here's a link to my DCS newsletter essay with background and analysis: http://www.digitalcinemasociety.org/essay/where-the-12k-rubber-hits-road-james-mathers-tests-blackmagic-ursa-mini-pro-12k#read And if you want to skip ahead to the finished video, here's a link to the HD SDR version on Vimeo: https://vimeo.com/485764350 (Note that a 4K HDR version will also be posted shortly.) James Mathers Cinematographer and Founder of DCS Studio City, CA
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Re: Further experiments with the G12
Colin Elves
I think you should be able to resolve this by using the right quicktime tags on export.
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This guide is useful: https://www.thepostprocess.com/2020/07/17/color-on-mac-displays-from-davinci-resolve-to-the-internet-with-quicktime-tags/ Colin Elves Director of Photography Bruxelles
On 30 Nov 2020, at 18:54, Art Adams <aadams@...> wrote:
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Further experiments with the G12
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Re: Further experiments with the G12
I’ll be posting a large collection of before and afters, that was just a teaser 😊
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From: cml-raw-log-hdr@... <cml-raw-log-hdr@...> On Behalf Of Matthew Woolf via cml.news
Sent: Monday, 30 November 2020 11:28 To: cml-raw-log-hdr@... Subject: Re: [cml-raw-log-hdr] Further experiments with the G12
Looks great thanks Geoff! Any chance you can post the before video as a comparison?
Thanks !
Matthew Matthew Woolf Director of Photography +1 917 399 9565 + 61 0466 834 239 Australia: AusCrew +61 (02) 9427 4444
Confidentiality Note: This e-mail is the property of Matthew Woolf. It is intended only for the person or entity to which it is addressed and may contain information that is privileged, confidential, or otherwise protected from disclosure. Distribution or copying of this e-mail, or the information contained herein, to anyone other than the intended recipient is prohibited.
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Re: Further experiments with the G12
Matthew Woolf
Looks great thanks Geoff!
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Any chance you can post the before video as a comparison? Thanks ! Matthew Matthew Woolf Director of Photography www.matthewwoolf.com +1 917 399 9565 + 61 0466 834 239 US Agent: DDATalent +1 310 474 4585 Commercial: Juanita Tiangco Narrative: Dan Burnside Australia: AusCrew +61 (02) 9427 4444 Confidentiality Note: This e-mail is the property of Matthew Woolf. It is intended only for the person or entity to which it is addressed and may contain information that is privileged, confidential, or otherwise protected from disclosure. Distribution or copying of this e-mail, or the information contained herein, to anyone other than the intended recipient is prohibited.
On Nov 30, 2020, at 04:20, Ben Allan ACS <benallan@...> wrote:
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Re: Further experiments with the G12
Mitch Gross
Geoff, very impressive. Definitely shows the viability of such stabilization.
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Just for edification, could you post a high resolution magnification of a corner of the image, just to help see the point at which it may break down? I think it will hold up extremely well due to the sheer volume of resolution, but an 800x mag. may prove interesting. Or not. :) Mitch Gross New York
On Nov 30, 2020, at 2:22 AM, Geoff Boyle <geoff@...> wrote:
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Re: Further experiments with the G12
Ben Allan ACS
This looks great Geoff.
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Ben
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Re: Further experiments with the G12
This is the first of a series of tests shot on a BMD 12K with frame lines for 8K within that. The point of this test is to try stabilising handheld shots.
cheers Become a CML Patron https://www.patreon.com/bePatron?u=43292735
From: cml-raw-log-hdr@... <cml-raw-log-hdr@...> On Behalf Of patancillo@...
Sent: Sunday, 29 November 2020 22:10 To: cml-raw-log-hdr@... Subject: Re: [cml-raw-log-hdr] Further experiments with the G12
How are you dealing with lens distortion on the reframing/repostioning?
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Re: Further experiments with the G12
patancillo@...
How are you dealing with lens distortion on the reframing/repostioning?
Claudio Rocha East Los Angeles.
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Re: Further experiments with the G12
This post work sounds intense and increasingly like aspects of animation too. Props to you Geoff for digging in. I look forward to seeing all your tests.
-- Guy Mastrion Creative_Director_DP_Professor www.linkedin.com/in/guymastrion insta: gmastrion
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Further experiments with the G12
I’m a few weeks away but I will be publishing a series of tests that I’ve been shooting with the BMD G12
I’m shooting at 12K but with a 8K frameline. I am using a shutter angle as small as I can so that each frame is as sharp as it can be. Every shot is either handheld or resting on a fence post etc. In Resolve I am stabilising the shots withing the 8K area so I have a huge amount of repositioning room. I’m using point stabilisation most of the time. I’m then adding motion blur so that anything moving in shot looks “normal”
I had hoped to be finished by now but I’m using R17 and have suffered some of the “black grades” that are afflicting people.
As this approach can cause issues with Pans or tilts I’m trying to accommodate for that by using the extra room around the image to start biased to one side and then moving across the image in post. This can be combined with “real” pans & tilts to feather off starts and stops.
Is it time consuming? Oh yes 😊 but it’s time consuming at the cheap end of a production.
cheers Become a CML Patron https://www.patreon.com/bePatron?u=43292735
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Re: Codex HDE
Loic de Lame
Hi Kyle.
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I am currently on a TV show shooting ArriRAW on LFs and utilizing HDE. I’ve also used it on a feature last year and a fashion job in Feb this year. No complaints from clients and there is no difference between ArriRAW and HDE. Frankly, in my opinion, it’s a no brainer to use HDE. The equivalent example I use is it’s like ZIP-ing a file. With regards to download times, I can say that the compression doesn’t add time to transfers. The only thing to be aware of is that you just have a program capable of handling HDE to do the transfer. You cannot do a finder drag and drop. Highly recommend: * Pomfort Offloader/Silverstack * Hedge Hope this helps! ~L From: Kyle Krupinski <kyle.krupinski@...> Reply: cml-raw-log-hdr@... <cml-raw-log-hdr@...> Date: November 13, 2020 at 21:16:17 To: cml-raw-log-hdr@... <cml-raw-log-hdr@...> Subject: [cml-raw-log-hdr] Codex HDE
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Codex HDE
Kyle Krupinski
I'm curious if anyone is advocating for or using high density encoding with codex cards. I own an Alexa SXT plus and have been shooting a lot of Arri raw with XR cards on commercial projects and I'm curious about using HDE to save my clients some drive space. Is there any reason to be concerned about data compression being applied during the transfer? I have no problem shooting with compression ratios when I'm using a RED but I'm skeptical about it being applied after image capture.
Cheers! Kyle Krupinski DP Los Angeles
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Re: External recording Using Alexa
Thank you all for the responses It is clear to me now that the most important setting will be what is coming out of UE to our recorder Thanks again
El El vie, 30 de oct. de 2020 a la(s) 8:45 p. m., Adrian Jebef via cml.news <adrianjebef=yahoo.com@...> escribió:
--
Oscar Molano DIT/Camera Assistant Bogotá, Colombia
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Re: External recording Using Alexa
Adrian Jebef
Note that the Alexa SXT can only output 16:9 HD. Setting the camera into a different recording mode / resolution (3.4K open gate, 3.2K ProRes, 2K etc) will result in scaling issues as the camera will scale down these other modes to fit into its 1920x1080 video out stream. For a full frame image you’ll want to be in 16:9 HD mode.
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Adrian Jebef DIT (626) 840-1260
On Oct 30, 2020, at 5:40 PM, Andy Jarosz <andy@...> wrote:
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Re: External recording Using Alexa
Andy Jarosz
You'll need a capture card for the computer running Unreal,
Blackmagic Decklinks are the best supported.
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Genlock into the camera and the Decklink to ensure frame sync, and then do whatever you need too within Unreal. It's fairly straightforward. Your output will be a BlackMagicMediaOutput blueprint. All details on this here: https://docs.unrealengine.com/en-US/Engine/ProVideoIO/BlackmagicQuickStart/index.html It doesn't really matter what the camera is outputting as long as it's a supported frame rate and res. You can apply LUTs in Unreal, or you can use postprocessing to match Unreal to the camera. Just depends on what you want to do. If you're using Composure within Unreal, you can use the SDI out of the Decklink into whatever recorder you want. As Bob mentioned, this is a different signal and is independent of the camera. You can also just output the foreground or background elements from Unreal and record the camera feed separately for compositing in post. -- Andy Jarosz MadlyFX & LOLED Virtual loledvirtual.com Andy@... 708.420.2639 Chicago, IL On 10/30/2020 1:
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Re: External recording Using Alexa
Bob Kertesz
If I read your post correctly, you will be feeding the Alexa Monitor
Out to the Unreal Engine, generating a composited image of some sort
in the Engine, then you want to record the composited output of the
Engine on an external recorder.
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Which means it's the output resolution/colorspace/framerate of the Engine that's relevant, not that of the Alexa. The Alexa needs to feed what the Engine wants to see. I'm not familiar with the Unreal Engine, and their web site is endless flashy marketing with little technical detail (I got bored after about five minutes of trying to find some), but it's likely you can set its output resolution/colorspace/framerate, so you have to decide what that will be and get a recorder to record that. Unless I misread what you wrote, you will not be recording the Alexa directly at all - it's the foreground input for a downstream composite. -Bob Bob Kertesz BlueScreen LLC Hollywood, California Mostly Retired Engineer, Video Controller, and Live Compositor Extraordinaire. High quality images for almost five decades - whether you've wanted them or not.© * * * * * * * * * *
On 10/29/2020 12:25:16 PM, Oscar Molano
wrote:
Hello
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Re: External recording Using Alexa
Mitch Gross
I believe the Monitor Out from the camera will be limited to HD 16:9 4:2:2 10-bit. You can record this in uncompressed DPX files on the Odyssey7Q+ but I highly doubt you will see any advantage over recording in ProRes 422HQ. That’s available in many recorders.
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If you output in Log-C you can record in Log-C and set the recorder’s live output to either Log-C or to apply a LUT. Modern recorders have a standard Log-C to Rec709 included as an option or you can load a custom LUT. Please note that all recorders and most LUT boxes only output a 17x LUT, so even if they allow you to load a 33x or 64x LUT it will be concatenated to a 17x. For most used this is fine but I point it out in case you’re use with Unreal Engine may have an issue. I believe the IS-Mini will apply un-concatenated LUTs. Mitch Gross New York
On Oct 30, 2020, at 1:30 AM, Adrian Jebef via cml.news <adrianjebef=yahoo.com@...> wrote:
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Re: External recording Using Alexa
Adrian Jebef
Because the SXT doesn’t have a dedicated Rec Out for external recorders like the old Classics do your best bet is to set the camera into HD 16:9 mode and set your outs to clean. There are plenty of recorders on the market that will record uncompressed or compressed codecs. Log or gamma corrected. 422 or 444.
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Adrian Jebef DIT (626) 840-1260
On Oct 29, 2020, at 8:34 PM, Mark Kenfield <mark@...> wrote:
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Re: External recording Using Alexa
Mark Kenfield
The Odyssey7Q will let you record both uncompressed DPX or Prores4444 XQ, so that's your best option for getting the highest possible quality external recording. I think most of the others are limited to regular Prores4444 (though some might do XQ as well). That said, I forget if the SXT can actually output 4:4:4 externally, or if you're limited to 4:2:2 🤔
On Fri, 30 Oct 2020 at 14:07, Oscar Molano <oscmol19@...> wrote: Hello
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