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Best Color settings Resolve for stills


Dick Harrewijin
 

Hello CML,

I'm a cinematographer and I'm trying to create the best stills from a project I've been a DOP for.
I'm working on stills selection from a project that I've shot as DOP. The stills will be published in a photo book so the best quality is key.
Stills selection is almost finished. Over 800 stills now. I'm planning to do some extra corrections in Lightroom on the tiff files.
I'm a bit lost in all the color settings in Resolve and I was hoping maybe someone here could point me in the right direction?

So this is what I'm doing:
I choose to work in Resolve Studio.
I've selected stills from the original footage by cutting single frames from the original footage and placing these all on a timeline.
Most of the footage is shot with Venice in XOCN-ST. But there are also a few other sources shot with H264/5 (A7s3, z-cams) and some Arri raw, DJI drones etc. Crazy!

I decided not to use the 'grab still' option as this uses the project settings resolution. But original footage has different source resolutions, most are 6K.
So I thought exporting through the delivery tab using tiff 16bit with 'source resolution' selected would get the best output resolution possible without sorting everything by the source/resolution size.
My monitor is calibrated to 99% P3. I'm asked to deliver the stills in Adobe RGB after Lightroom.

So my question; Who could point me in the right direction for the best color/project settings?
Would it be best to work in DaVinci YRGB Color Managed? What color processing mode? And what output? 
My guess would be the above with SDR Rec-2020 and output to P3-DCI?
Or is it better to work in Aces maybe? 

I've been in doubt this would be a better fit in POST but considering this message might be just as interesting to other cinematographers out there I decided to post it here. I will move it as listmums don't agree.

Your help is much appreciated!
 
All the best from the Netherlands,
 
Dick Harrewijn
Cinematography for documentary and wildlife 
+31 6 1818 2655


Kevin Shaw
 

Hi Dick

To optimise your project settings without unnecessary complications
Are you using color grades from the project, or just capturing from camera raw? 
If the material is already graded - what colourspace are those files?

You talk about the file formats, but not the colourspace, but it sounds like you are going to be dealing with slog/sgamut(cine) , LogC/AWG and possibly Dlog and some other odd ones.
In that case you should definitely use color managed - resolve or ACES. Either way you may need some custom input transforms

In Aces the timeline will be ACES cct. For resolve use the new resolve DI settings (eg the biggest space you can select - both are bigger than all the camera sources)

I would recommend that you do the grade in resolve, but use the color management to start with something as close to what you shot as possible

Set the display CMS output to your best display setting - probably P3 D65 Gamma 2.4 (dim room) or Gamma 2.2 (lit room) and export it as that. What you see is what you get
Lightroom recognises P3, if you scale it to Adobe RGB for delivery it will be P3 limited and look the same as it does on your display

Regarding ACES or Resolve CMS, I prefer ACES it might be easier to find Slog IDTs and things. But resolve CMS is more flexible for tone and gamut mapping. In this case you could sort by camera and use whichever CMS gives you the best result

Best
Kevin

Kevin Shaw, CSI
kevs@...          colorist, instructor and consultant

mobile: +44 7921 677 369
skype: kevscolor

finalcolor: www.finalcolor.com 
ICA:          www.icolorist.com      

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On 7 Feb 2022, at 12:50, Dick Harrewijin <ik@...> wrote:

Hello CML,

I'm a cinematographer and I'm trying to create the best stills from a project I've been a DOP for.
I'm working on stills selection from a project that I've shot as DOP. The stills will be published in a photo book so the best quality is key.
Stills selection is almost finished. Over 800 stills now. I'm planning to do some extra corrections in Lightroom on the tiff files.


Jonny Revolt
 

If you put your footage on a timeline and go to the color room in DaVinci  you can use  the color room to color your video  then choose each frame you like hit Opt+Cmd G to grab a still  and it will show up in your stills gallery top left, you can also make stills bins in the Gallery window, then hit cmd A to select all and export the stills by right clicking as DPX files or tiffs with display LUT applied.  Don’t use the delivery room for stills it’s only for video. 

Be well,


Jonny Revolt
DIT
Local 600
Santa Monica/Atlanta
IMDB
310-409-5795

On Feb 7, 2022, 08:06 -0500, Dick Harrewijin <ik@...>, wrote:
Hello CML,

I'm a cinematographer and I'm trying to create the best stills from a project I've been a DOP for.
I'm working on stills selection from a project that I've shot as DOP. The stills will be published in a photo book so the best quality is key.
Stills selection is almost finished. Over 800 stills now. I'm planning to do some extra corrections in Lightroom on the tiff files.
I'm a bit lost in all the color settings in Resolve and I was hoping maybe someone here could point me in the right direction?

So this is what I'm doing:
I choose to work in Resolve Studio.
I've selected stills from the original footage by cutting single frames from the original footage and placing these all on a timeline.
Most of the footage is shot with Venice in XOCN-ST. But there are also a few other sources shot with H264/5 (A7s3, z-cams) and some Arri raw, DJI drones etc. Crazy!

I decided not to use the 'grab still' option as this uses the project settings resolution. But original footage has different source resolutions, most are 6K.
So I thought exporting through the delivery tab using tiff 16bit with 'source resolution' selected would get the best output resolution possible without sorting everything by the source/resolution size.
My monitor is calibrated to 99% P3. I'm asked to deliver the stills in Adobe RGB after Lightroom.

So my question; Who could point me in the right direction for the best color/project settings?
Would it be best to work in DaVinci YRGB Color Managed? What color processing mode? And what output? 
My guess would be the above with SDR Rec-2020 and output to P3-DCI?
Or is it better to work in Aces maybe? 

I've been in doubt this would be a better fit in POST but considering this message might be just as interesting to other cinematographers out there I decided to post it here. I will move it as listmums don't agree.

Your help is much appreciated!
 
All the best from the Netherlands,
 
Dick Harrewijn
Cinematography for documentary and wildlife 
+31 6 1818 2655


Nezih Savaşkan
 

On Mon, Feb 7, 2022 at 01:06 PM, Dick Harrewijin wrote:
My guess would be the above with SDR Rec-2020 and output to P3-DCI?
 For stills export, you'd probably want something that converts to RGB wouldn't you? So, I assume you'd want the output to be something like sRGB, rather than DCI-P3. Or, even CMYK if you know how the print workflow is going to be!

Unless you specifically want to grade in Resolve, I'd suggest considering scrapping Resolve entirely, and instead opening the X-OCN ST files in Sony's RAW Viewer. You can make basic adjustments there if required. Then export them as 16-bit (or even 32-bit) OpenEXR files, you can load those into Photoshop/Affinity to do further tweaks in a photography environment.

I don't think Photoshop/Affinity will see them as RAW files, but I expect this is the bets way to preserve as much of the source data as possible and bring them into a stills friendly environment?

Having said that, the Resolve workflow might be better for the files from other cameras...

And if your monitor is calibrated to P3, in Resovle you can monitor in P3, but export in sRGB. Though of course your monitor won't be a fully correct representation for how it'll look for print.


Adrian Jebef
 

Also note that unless your timeline resolution matches your OCN resolution (ie 6K) you will get inferior stills or video on render. If you grab stills or do color grading with a HD timeline and then export 6K Tiffs you are scaling 6K to HD and then scaling HD to 6K on export.

Best is to finish your grade. Switch to a native resolution timeline. And then grab stills.

Adrian Jebef 
DIT
(626) 840-1260

On Feb 7, 2022, at 8:11 AM, Nezih Savaşkan via cml.news <nez=videosoul.co.uk@...> wrote:

On Mon, Feb 7, 2022 at 01:06 PM, Dick Harrewijin wrote:
My guess would be the above with SDR Rec-2020 and output to P3-DCI?
 For stills export, you'd probably want something that converts to RGB wouldn't you? So, I assume you'd want the output to be something like sRGB, rather than DCI-P3. Or, even CMYK if you know how the print workflow is going to be!

Unless you specifically want to grade in Resolve, I'd suggest considering scrapping Resolve entirely, and instead opening the X-OCN ST files in Sony's RAW Viewer. You can make basic adjustments there if required. Then export them as 16-bit (or even 32-bit) OpenEXR files, you can load those into Photoshop/Affinity to do further tweaks in a photography environment.

I don't think Photoshop/Affinity will see them as RAW files, but I expect this is the bets way to preserve as much of the source data as possible and bring them into a stills friendly environment?

Having said that, the Resolve workflow might be better for the files from other cameras...

And if your monitor is calibrated to P3, in Resovle you can monitor in P3, but export in sRGB. Though of course your monitor won't be a fully correct representation for how it'll look for print.


Guy Mastrion
 

However you get there, I would also suggest bringing the files into photoshop for final finishing and output for the printer. It’s going to be important to have a conversation with the printer and discuss the printing method. Just like cameras, printing presses and methods have their own unique characteristics. Newer digital presses are more like advanced ink jet printers than a traditional plate driven press. A new digital press is going to give you highly accurate representations of your images as you finish them, certain older but very high quality analogue presses will tend to get a slight gain on red, for instance, and it takes a really skilled pressmen to match your intent and even then it will not be 100%. The other variable factor in a traditional press is the layout of the book. Images on the same signature (a signature is 4 pages like a spread) will impact the color of all the images on that signature, so adjusting for one, will impact the rest. Who makes this decision will determine the look of your images as printed. If your images will appear on signatures with images not created by you, and not matching, will impact the look of any image on the signature, so who makes the call on the press is really important. See if you can have a chat with the pressmen/woman and learn the type of press, the make up of the book and how it will be run to work towards an agreeable outcome. I say agreeable as it will be the rare job that prints all of your images with the care as you put into rendering them. You can ask if they will pull a few proof sheets for you and then you can discuss how much control they have to meet your requested adjustments. You may find it necessary to adjust your images in photoshop to find a happy compromise — depending on the printing method and how the project will made on press.

I’m happy to discuss this further if it will be helpful -  you can email me directly guy@...
--
Guy Mastrion
Creative_Director_DP_Professor
www.linkedin.com/in/guymastrion
insta: gmastrion


Charles Boileau
 

Hi Dick,

I second what Guy is saying. Using resolve here is not the way to go. You want to keep things in a photo/printing space. I do my own printing and manage film/vfx colors at work. So I have a bit of experience here. Any printer will assume that (if not specified) your images will be in sRGB. Especially, online ones. And the other issue here would be resolution coming out of Resolve... You can't really define anything here. Plus your colorspace might not be embedded properly. This might cause some errors with ICC profiles.

If you want to use LUTs, you can do so directly in Photoshop.

Cheers!
--
My views and opinions do not reflect the ones of my employer. Whatever I say here is just me talking!!!
Charles Boileau, ex-Cinematographer, ex-Colorist and now: Regional Lead Imaging Engineer at Technicolor.
Montreal, Québec, Canada.