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Vista Vision - Exact Format Size

Mike Nagel
 

HI folks,

this just came up again in a chat w/ colleagues... VV is stated all over the place, yet nobody seems to know the exact size of the format....

So... what is the exact size of the VV format in mm ?

Thanks.

- Mike Nagel
Director/Producer
L.A.

Tom Debenham
 

Strictly speaking full camera aperture for motion picture 8 perf 35mm film is 37.39 x 25.32mm- an aspect ratio of 1.47:1, but the projection extraction size is a little more complicated historically:

http://www.widescreenmuseum.com/widescreen/vvspecs.htm

It’s generally simplified to be the full frame 35mm stills format (still 8 perf) which is 36 x 24mm - an aspect ratio of 1.5:1

Basically 2 full aperture super 35 frames on top of each other turned 90 degrees!

Interestingly, the Red Monstro / Panavision DXL sensor is not full Vistavision height, although it is wider: 40.96 x 21.6mm. 
Alexa LF is 36.7 x 25.54
Sony Venice is 36.2 x 24.1

Hope this helps, please anyone correct if I have mis-stated anything. 


Tom Debenham
DoP / vfx - London





VV is stated all over the place, yet nobody seems to know the exact size of the format....


So... what is the exact size of the VV format in mm ?

Philip Holland
 

You are correct Tom regarding VistaVision.  When we worked with VistaVision there was a lot of extraction from the full aperture 8-perf for the correct aspect ratio determined on a project by project basis.


In an age where 1.9:1, 16x9, and 2:39:1 are the primary format sizes, the general dimensions for the digital cinema cameras with the VV, LF, and FF35 flavors works pretty well:


http://phfx.com/tools/formatCompare/formatCompare.cgi?formatOne_typeTech=RED%7CMonstro+8K+VV&formatOne_format=8K+FF&formatTwo_typeTech=Kodak%7CFilm&formatTwo_format=VistaVision+8-Perf&focalLengths=


Readily available 2X anamorphic lenses are optimized mostly on the max vertical and horizontal format size of Super 35mm with some designed more towards the vertical of Academy 35mm.  1.3X mostly is the same as well, however, you'll see as with some of the older anamorphic glass for larger format sizes like 1.25X can utilize more of the image plane on these cameras.


Best,


Phil


-----------------

Phil Holland - Cinematographer
http://www.phfx.com
http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0390802/
818 470 0623


From: cml-raw-log-hdr@... <cml-raw-log-hdr@...> on behalf of Tom Debenham <tom@...>
Sent: Saturday, March 31, 2018 4:21:18 AM
To: cml-raw-log-hdr@...
Subject: Re: [raw-log-hdr] Vista Vision - Exact Format Size
 
Strictly speaking full camera aperture for motion picture 8 perf 35mm film is 37.39 x 25.32mm- an aspect ratio of 1.47:1, but the projection extraction size is a little more complicated historically:

http://www.widescreenmuseum.com/widescreen/vvspecs.htm

It’s generally simplified to be the full frame 35mm stills format (still 8 perf) which is 36 x 24mm - an aspect ratio of 1.5:1

Basically 2 full aperture super 35 frames on top of each other turned 90 degrees!

Interestingly, the Red Monstro / Panavision DXL sensor is not full Vistavision height, although it is wider: 40.96 x 21.6mm. 
Alexa LF is 36.7 x 25.54
Sony Venice is 36.2 x 24.1

Hope this helps, please anyone correct if I have mis-stated anything. 


Tom Debenham
DoP / vfx - London





VV is stated all over the place, yet nobody seems to know the exact size of the format....

So... what is the exact size of the VV format in mm ?

Tom Debenham
 

Yes, I was looking at Ultra Panavision 1.25x anamorphics (a la Ben Hur) as an option for a job that was going to be full frame / VV cameras. They would give very close to  1.85:1 aspect ratio from full sensor. 

Widest lens is 35mm which is pretty good with 1.25 squeeze- equates to 28mm, or around 18mm in super 35 language. 

It would have involved custom adapters though..



Tom Debenham
DoP / vfx - London


 some of the older anamorphic glass for larger format sizes like 1.25X can utilize more of the image plane on these cameras.


Michael Cioni
 

Tom-

While it's not the case with all anamorphics, the Ultra Panatar lenses you spoke of on DXL have full coverage of the 1.9 VV sensor, allowing you to shoot full aperture 8K and de-squeeze to 2.37:1 with no cropping.  We have this mode in DXL (1.25x) for this lens format in particular.



On Sat, Mar 31, 2018 at 10:42 AM, Tom Debenham <tom@...> wrote:
Yes, I was looking at Ultra Panavision 1.25x anamorphics (a la Ben Hur) as an option for a job that was going to be full frame / VV cameras. They would give very close to  1.85:1 aspect ratio from full sensor. 

Widest lens is 35mm which is pretty good with 1.25 squeeze- equates to 28mm, or around 18mm in super 35 language. 

It would have involved custom adapters though..



Tom Debenham
DoP / vfx - London


 some of the older anamorphic glass for larger format sizes like 1.25X can utilize more of the image plane on these cameras.





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Michael Cioni
Senior Vice President of Innovation
Panavision & Light Iron

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