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Wave-Freefly Hi Speed Camera


Andrew Boulter
 


I tested one of the Wave-Freefly cameras today here in Dubai and came across some issues, and was hoping that those with more knowledge than me, I come from the old world, so my sensor knowledge has wide gaps, could, either tell me what the issue is, and secondly perhaps point out what I did wrong.

Those familiar with these cameras know that the menu system is insanely simple, you basically have size, 4k or 2K, frame rate, upto 420fps in 4k and 1440fps in 2k, shutter angle and a kelvin setting.  Its very small, not much bigger than the original BMPCC and has internal battery and 2TB internal memory.  The workflow is a little clunky, but early days, only works on PC at the moment, the mac one we couldn’t get to function.  but, its a $10K camera……lots to like.

I shot some very unscientific tests filming water both in 4k and 2K at 420 and 1440fps respectively.  The 4K looks pretty clean, but I could see some vertical lines in the shadow areas, however when shooting 2K 1440fps the lines were so evident that frankly the footage would be unusable.  My question is, I don’t know what these lines are……..I am hoping its something that I am doing wrong, but need to be enlightened.  

I have attached a couple of small png's of a frame shot at 1440fps, once downloaded they were put through resolve and then exported as an mp4.  I’d love to share the footage, just let me know, I can share via wetransfer or similar, but I am hoping these screen grabs show you the vertical line issue.  Top left hand corner in the shadow area is where its very evident.

I shot using a 32mm Master Prime, so I don’t feel its a lens issue.

Hope someone can help






Thanks,

Andrew Boulter
Director of Photography
UK based but thanks to Covid, currently in Dubai for the foreseeable
+447768877686
+971585047839






alister@...
 

To me this looks like a problem with lights where the cmos sensor is operating faster than the lights are cycling. Try again with daylight or other lights with high speed ballast suitable for high frame rates or perhaps tungsten lights.


Alister Chapman 

Cinematographer - DIT - Consultant
UK Mobile/Whatsapp +44 7711 152226


Facebook: Alister Chapman
Twitter: @stormguy



www.xdcam-user.com    1.5 million hits, 100,000 visits from over 45,000 unique visitors every month!  Film and Video production techniques, reviews and news.


















On 1 Apr 2021, at 16:27, Andrew Boulter <andrew@...> wrote:


I tested one of the Wave-Freefly cameras today here in Dubai and came across some issues, and was hoping that those with more knowledge than me, I come from the old world, so my sensor knowledge has wide gaps, could, either tell me what the issue is, and secondly perhaps point out what I did wrong.

Those familiar with these cameras know that the menu system is insanely simple, you basically have size, 4k or 2K, frame rate, upto 420fps in 4k and 1440fps in 2k, shutter angle and a kelvin setting.  Its very small, not much bigger than the original BMPCC and has internal battery and 2TB internal memory.  The workflow is a little clunky, but early days, only works on PC at the moment, the mac one we couldn’t get to function.  but, its a $10K camera……lots to like.

I shot some very unscientific tests filming water both in 4k and 2K at 420 and 1440fps respectively.  The 4K looks pretty clean, but I could see some vertical lines in the shadow areas, however when shooting 2K 1440fps the lines were so evident that frankly the footage would be unusable.  My question is, I don’t know what these lines are……..I am hoping its something that I am doing wrong, but need to be enlightened.  

I have attached a couple of small png's of a frame shot at 1440fps, once downloaded they were put through resolve and then exported as an mp4.  I’d love to share the footage, just let me know, I can share via wetransfer or similar, but I am hoping these screen grabs show you the vertical line issue.  Top left hand corner in the shadow area is where its very evident.

I shot using a 32mm Master Prime, so I don’t feel its a lens issue.

Hope someone can help


<Screenshot 2021-04-01 at 16.18.34.png>
<Screenshot 2021-04-01 at 15.58.45.png>




Thanks,

Andrew Boulter
Director of Photography
UK based but thanks to Covid, currently in Dubai for the foreseeable
+447768877686
+971585047839







alister@...
 

Sorry all. After writing my reply re lights I realised that what I was looking at was two images one above the other, not a single image. Doh.

So ignore my comments about lights. I’m not sure the frame are large enough to see the issue clearly. But often with high speed cameras there is no correction for black levels or incorrect pixels. Often you need to subtract a dark frame (lens capped) from your footage to clean it up an normalise the blacks.


Alister Chapman 

Cinematographer - DIT - Consultant
UK Mobile/Whatsapp +44 7711 152226


Facebook: Alister Chapman
Twitter: @stormguy


After writing my reply I realise the way the 
www.xdcam-user.com    1.5 million hits, 100,000 visits from over 45,000 unique visitors every month!  Film and Video production techniques, reviews and news.


















On 1 Apr 2021, at 17:18, Alister Chapman <alister@...> wrote:

To me this looks like a problem with lights where the cmos sensor is operating faster than the lights are cycling. Try again with daylight or other lights with high speed ballast suitable for high frame rates or perhaps tungsten lights.


Alister Chapman 

Cinematographer - DIT - Consultant
UK Mobile/Whatsapp +44 7711 152226


Facebook: Alister Chapman
Twitter: @stormguy



www.xdcam-user.com    1.5 million hits, 100,000 visits from over 45,000 unique visitors every month!  Film and Video production techniques, reviews and news.


















On 1 Apr 2021, at 16:27, Andrew Boulter <andrew@...> wrote:


I tested one of the Wave-Freefly cameras today here in Dubai and came across some issues, and was hoping that those with more knowledge than me, I come from the old world, so my sensor knowledge has wide gaps, could, either tell me what the issue is, and secondly perhaps point out what I did wrong.

Those familiar with these cameras know that the menu system is insanely simple, you basically have size, 4k or 2K, frame rate, upto 420fps in 4k and 1440fps in 2k, shutter angle and a kelvin setting.  Its very small, not much bigger than the original BMPCC and has internal battery and 2TB internal memory.  The workflow is a little clunky, but early days, only works on PC at the moment, the mac one we couldn’t get to function.  but, its a $10K camera……lots to like.

I shot some very unscientific tests filming water both in 4k and 2K at 420 and 1440fps respectively.  The 4K looks pretty clean, but I could see some vertical lines in the shadow areas, however when shooting 2K 1440fps the lines were so evident that frankly the footage would be unusable.  My question is, I don’t know what these lines are……..I am hoping its something that I am doing wrong, but need to be enlightened.  

I have attached a couple of small png's of a frame shot at 1440fps, once downloaded they were put through resolve and then exported as an mp4.  I’d love to share the footage, just let me know, I can share via wetransfer or similar, but I am hoping these screen grabs show you the vertical line issue.  Top left hand corner in the shadow area is where its very evident.

I shot using a 32mm Master Prime, so I don’t feel its a lens issue.

Hope someone can help


<Screenshot 2021-04-01 at 16.18.34.png>
<Screenshot 2021-04-01 at 15.58.45.png>




Thanks,

Andrew Boulter
Director of Photography
UK based but thanks to Covid, currently in Dubai for the foreseeable
+447768877686
+971585047839








Barry Bassett
 

I bought one of these for our rental division and the engineering guys felt that the quality of this camera had some real issues which made its purchase unwise.

 

Barry Bassett

Rental company, VMI, London


Andrew Boulter
 

Thanks Alister, seems I forgot to mention one important thing, it was lit with sunlight alone, so its not that.

Andrew 

Andrew Boulter
Director of Photography
UK based but thanks to Covid, currently in Dubai for the foreseeable
+447768877686
+971585047839


On 1 Apr 2021, at 17:18, alister@... wrote:

To me this looks like a problem with lights where the cmos sensor is operating faster than the lights are cycling. Try again with daylight or other lights with high speed ballast suitable for high frame rates or perhaps tungsten lights.


Alister Chapman 

Cinematographer - DIT - Consultant
UK Mobile/Whatsapp +44 7711 152226


Facebook: Alister Chapman
Twitter: @stormguy



www.xdcam-user.com    1.5 million hits, 100,000 visits from over 45,000 unique visitors every month!  Film and Video production techniques, reviews and news.


















On 1 Apr 2021, at 16:27, Andrew Boulter <andrew@...> wrote:


I tested one of the Wave-Freefly cameras today here in Dubai and came across some issues, and was hoping that those with more knowledge than me, I come from the old world, so my sensor knowledge has wide gaps, could, either tell me what the issue is, and secondly perhaps point out what I did wrong.

Those familiar with these cameras know that the menu system is insanely simple, you basically have size, 4k or 2K, frame rate, upto 420fps in 4k and 1440fps in 2k, shutter angle and a kelvin setting.  Its very small, not much bigger than the original BMPCC and has internal battery and 2TB internal memory.  The workflow is a little clunky, but early days, only works on PC at the moment, the mac one we couldn’t get to function.  but, its a $10K camera……lots to like.

I shot some very unscientific tests filming water both in 4k and 2K at 420 and 1440fps respectively.  The 4K looks pretty clean, but I could see some vertical lines in the shadow areas, however when shooting 2K 1440fps the lines were so evident that frankly the footage would be unusable.  My question is, I don’t know what these lines are……..I am hoping its something that I am doing wrong, but need to be enlightened.  

I have attached a couple of small png's of a frame shot at 1440fps, once downloaded they were put through resolve and then exported as an mp4.  I’d love to share the footage, just let me know, I can share via wetransfer or similar, but I am hoping these screen grabs show you the vertical line issue.  Top left hand corner in the shadow area is where its very evident.

I shot using a 32mm Master Prime, so I don’t feel its a lens issue.

Hope someone can help


<Screenshot 2021-04-01 at 16.18.34.png>
<Screenshot 2021-04-01 at 15.58.45.png>




Thanks,

Andrew Boulter
Director of Photography
UK based but thanks to Covid, currently in Dubai for the foreseeable
+447768877686
+971585047839








Mitch Gross
 

I believe Freefly just released a firmware update that expanded dynamic range along with other improvements. There’s also a new player for use on Macs. 



Mitch Gross
New York

On Apr 1, 2021, at 1:42 PM, Andrew Boulter <andrew@...> wrote:

Thanks Alister, seems I forgot to mention one important thing, it was lit with sunlight alone, so its not that.

Andrew 

Andrew Boulter
Director of Photography
UK based but thanks to Covid, currently in Dubai for the foreseeable
+447768877686
+971585047839


On 1 Apr 2021, at 17:18, alister@... wrote:

To me this looks like a problem with lights where the cmos sensor is operating faster than the lights are cycling. Try again with daylight or other lights with high speed ballast suitable for high frame rates or perhaps tungsten lights.


Alister Chapman 

Cinematographer - DIT - Consultant
UK Mobile/Whatsapp +44 7711 152226


Facebook: Alister Chapman
Twitter: @stormguy



www.xdcam-user.com    1.5 million hits, 100,000 visits from over 45,000 unique visitors every month!  Film and Video production techniques, reviews and news.


















On 1 Apr 2021, at 16:27, Andrew Boulter <andrew@...> wrote:


I tested one of the Wave-Freefly cameras today here in Dubai and came across some issues, and was hoping that those with more knowledge than me, I come from the old world, so my sensor knowledge has wide gaps, could, either tell me what the issue is, and secondly perhaps point out what I did wrong.

Those familiar with these cameras know that the menu system is insanely simple, you basically have size, 4k or 2K, frame rate, upto 420fps in 4k and 1440fps in 2k, shutter angle and a kelvin setting.  Its very small, not much bigger than the original BMPCC and has internal battery and 2TB internal memory.  The workflow is a little clunky, but early days, only works on PC at the moment, the mac one we couldn’t get to function.  but, its a $10K camera……lots to like.

I shot some very unscientific tests filming water both in 4k and 2K at 420 and 1440fps respectively.  The 4K looks pretty clean, but I could see some vertical lines in the shadow areas, however when shooting 2K 1440fps the lines were so evident that frankly the footage would be unusable.  My question is, I don’t know what these lines are……..I am hoping its something that I am doing wrong, but need to be enlightened.  

I have attached a couple of small png's of a frame shot at 1440fps, once downloaded they were put through resolve and then exported as an mp4.  I’d love to share the footage, just let me know, I can share via wetransfer or similar, but I am hoping these screen grabs show you the vertical line issue.  Top left hand corner in the shadow area is where its very evident.

I shot using a 32mm Master Prime, so I don’t feel its a lens issue.

Hope someone can help


<Screenshot 2021-04-01 at 16.18.34.png>
<Screenshot 2021-04-01 at 15.58.45.png>




Thanks,

Andrew Boulter
Director of Photography
UK based but thanks to Covid, currently in Dubai for the foreseeable
+447768877686
+971585047839








Colin Elves
 

I agree 100% with Alister: the frames are too small to judge (😃) but my initial assumption would be that it’s fixed pattern noise. Most cameras address this with a black balance. If that’s not an option here you’ll need to do it in post.

Colin Elves
Director of Photography
Back in Brussels

On 1 Apr 2021, at 20:10, Andrew Boulter <andrew@...> wrote:

Thanks Alister, seems I forgot to mention one important thing, it was lit with sunlight alone, so its not that.

Andrew


Art Adams
 

Just to be pedantically pedantic, it’s black shading that addresses fixed pattern noise. My understand is that you’re creating an offset map that addresses unevenness in noise across the sensor, often due to heat differences or other oddities.

 

Black balance is only about ensuring that the color of black is actually black, and not purplish black, blueish black, greenish black, etc.

 

-Art

 

_______________________________________________________
Art 
Adams
Cinema Lens Specialist
ARRI Inc.
3700 Vanowen Street
BurbankCA 91505
www.arri.com 

818-841-7070
x4212
 
aadams@...

Get all the latest information from www.arri.comFacebookTwitterInstagram and YouTube.






This message is confidential. It may also be privileged or otherwise protected by work product immunity or other legal rules. If you have received it by mistake, please let us know by e-mail reply and delete it from your system; you may not copy this message or disclose its contents to anyone. Please send us by fax any message containing deadlines as incoming e-mails are not screened for response deadlines. The integrity and security of this message cannot be guaranteed on the Internet.


From: cml-raw-log-hdr@... <cml-raw-log-hdr@...> on behalf of Colin Elves via cml.news <colin=colinelves.com@...>
Date: Thursday, April 1, 2021 at 11:29 AM
To: cml-raw-log-hdr@... <cml-raw-log-hdr@...>
Subject: Re: [cml-raw-log-hdr] Wave-Freefly Hi Speed Camera

I agree 100% with Alister: the frames are too small to judge (😃) but my initial assumption would be that it’s fixed pattern noise. Most cameras address this with a black balance. If that’s not an option here you’ll need to do it in post.

Colin Elves
Director of Photography
Back in Brussels

On 1 Apr 2021, at 20:10, Andrew Boulter <andrew@...> wrote:

Thanks Alister, seems I forgot to mention one important thing, it was lit with sunlight alone, so its not that.

Andrew

 

This message is confidential. It may also be privileged or otherwise protected by work product immunity or other legal rules. If you have received it by mistake, please let us know by e-mail reply and delete it from your system; you may not copy this message or disclose its contents to anyone. Please send us by fax any message containing deadlines as incoming e-mails are not screened for response deadlines. The integrity and security of this message cannot be guaranteed on the Internet.


Andrew Boulter
 

Yes, sorry about the examples, they are not great, here’s one more, I have increased the brightness and raised the shadow areas just to so you can see the pattern.  I hasten to add this is only to see the lines, forget the colours etc.  One of my thoughts was that its to do with a black balance, which isn’t possible, I then thought perhaps the temperature of the sensor might be an issue, I know when shooting Phantom some techs have told me they want the camera to ‘warm up”  

My main question is , what is producing the pattern, obviously the sensor, but what part of it and why?



Andrew Boulter
Director of Photography
UK based but thanks to Covid, currently in Dubai for the foreseeable
+447768877686
+971585047839

On 1 Apr 2021, at 19:25, Colin Elves <colin@...> wrote:

I agree 100% with Alister: the frames are too small to judge (😃) but my initial assumption would be that it’s fixed pattern noise. Most cameras address this with a black balance. If that’s not an option here you’ll need to do it in post.

Colin Elves
Director of Photography
Back in Brussels

On 1 Apr 2021, at 20:10, Andrew Boulter <andrew@...> wrote:

Thanks Alister, seems I forgot to mention one important thing, it was lit with sunlight alone, so its not that.

Andrew


Colin Elves
 

I’d expect nothing less from CML.

Colin Elves
Director of Photography
Brussels

On 1 Apr 2021, at 21:01, Art Adams <aadams@...> wrote:



Just to be pedantically pedantic, 



Art Adams
 

Hi Andrew-

 

You’re thinking about black shading, not black balance. Black balance will just make sure black is black. Black shading is about eliminating noise and fixed patterns.

 

-Art

 

_______________________________________________________
Art 
Adams
Cinema Lens Specialist
ARRI Inc.
3700 Vanowen Street
BurbankCA 91505
www.arri.com 

818-841-7070
x4212
 
aadams@...

Get all the latest information from www.arri.comFacebookTwitterInstagram and YouTube.






This message is confidential. It may also be privileged or otherwise protected by work product immunity or other legal rules. If you have received it by mistake, please let us know by e-mail reply and delete it from your system; you may not copy this message or disclose its contents to anyone. Please send us by fax any message containing deadlines as incoming e-mails are not screened for response deadlines. The integrity and security of this message cannot be guaranteed on the Internet.


From: cml-raw-log-hdr@... <cml-raw-log-hdr@...> on behalf of Andrew Boulter via cml.news <andrew=andrewboulter.com@...>
Date: Thursday, April 1, 2021 at 12:06 PM
To: cml-raw-log-hdr@... <cml-raw-log-hdr@...>
Subject: Re: [cml-raw-log-hdr] Wave-Freefly Hi Speed Camera

Yes, sorry about the examples, they are not great, here’s one more, I have increased the brightness and raised the shadow areas just to so you can see the pattern.  I hasten to add this is only to see the lines, forget the colours etc.  One of my thoughts was that its to do with a black balance, which isn’t possible, I then thought perhaps the temperature of the sensor might be an issue, I know when shooting Phantom some techs have told me they want the camera to ‘warm up”  

 

My main question is , what is producing the pattern, obviously the sensor, but what part of it and why?

 

 

 

Andrew Boulter

Director of Photography

UK based but thanks to Covid, currently in Dubai for the foreseeable

+447768877686

+971585047839



On 1 Apr 2021, at 19:25, Colin Elves <colin@...> wrote:

 

I agree 100% with Alister: the frames are too small to judge (😃) but my initial assumption would be that it’s fixed pattern noise. Most cameras address this with a black balance. If that’s not an option here you’ll need to do it in post.

Colin Elves
Director of Photography
Back in Brussels

On 1 Apr 2021, at 20:10, Andrew Boulter <andrew@...> wrote:

Thanks Alister, seems I forgot to mention one important thing, it was lit with sunlight alone, so its not that.

Andrew

 

 

This message is confidential. It may also be privileged or otherwise protected by work product immunity or other legal rules. If you have received it by mistake, please let us know by e-mail reply and delete it from your system; you may not copy this message or disclose its contents to anyone. Please send us by fax any message containing deadlines as incoming e-mails are not screened for response deadlines. The integrity and security of this message cannot be guaranteed on the Internet.


Andrew Boulter
 

Thankyou Art, 

So my next question is would black shading solve the problem I am seeing, and is that something a firmware update can cure, or not…….?  

Andrew

Andrew Boulter
Director of Photography
UK based but thanks to Covid, currently in Dubai for the foreseeable
+447768877686
+971585047839

On 1 Apr 2021, at 20:20, Art Adams <aadams@...> wrote:

Hi Andrew-
 
You’re thinking about black shading, not black balance. Black balance will just make sure black is black. Black shading is about eliminating noise and fixed patterns.
 
-Art
 
_______________________________________________________
Art 
Adams
Cinema Lens Specialist
ARRI Inc.
3700 Vanowen Street
BurbankCA 91505
www.arri.com 

<image458551.png>
818-841-7070
x4212
 
<image888287.png>
aadams@...

Get all the latest information from www.arri.comFacebookTwitterInstagram and YouTube.






This message is confidential. It may also be privileged or otherwise protected by work product immunity or other legal rules. If you have received it by mistake, please let us know by e-mail reply and delete it from your system; you may not copy this message or disclose its contents to anyone. Please send us by fax any message containing deadlines as incoming e-mails are not screened for response deadlines. The integrity and security of this message cannot be guaranteed on the Internet.


From: cml-raw-log-hdr@... <cml-raw-log-hdr@...> on behalf of Andrew Boulter via cml.news <andrew=andrewboulter.com@...>
Date: Thursday, April 1, 2021 at 12:06 PM
To: cml-raw-log-hdr@... <cml-raw-log-hdr@...>
Subject: Re: [cml-raw-log-hdr] Wave-Freefly Hi Speed Camera

Yes, sorry about the examples, they are not great, here’s one more, I have increased the brightness and raised the shadow areas just to so you can see the pattern.  I hasten to add this is only to see the lines, forget the colours etc.  One of my thoughts was that its to do with a black balance, which isn’t possible, I then thought perhaps the temperature of the sensor might be an issue, I know when shooting Phantom some techs have told me they want the camera to ‘warm up”  
 
My main question is , what is producing the pattern, obviously the sensor, but what part of it and why?
 
<image001.jpg>
 
 
Andrew Boulter
Director of Photography
UK based but thanks to Covid, currently in Dubai for the foreseeable
+447768877686
+971585047839


On 1 Apr 2021, at 19:25, Colin Elves <colin@...> wrote:
 

I agree 100% with Alister: the frames are too small to judge (😃) but my initial assumption would be that it’s fixed pattern noise. Most cameras address this with a black balance. If that’s not an option here you’ll need to do it in post. 

Colin Elves
Director of Photography
Back in Brussels

On 1 Apr 2021, at 20:10, Andrew Boulter <andrew@...> wrote:

Thanks Alister, seems I forgot to mention one important thing, it was lit with sunlight alone, so its not that.

Andrew
 
 

This message is confidential. It may also be privileged or otherwise protected by work product immunity or other legal rules. If you have received it by mistake, please let us know by e-mail reply and delete it from your system; you may not copy this message or disclose its contents to anyone. Please send us by fax any message containing deadlines as incoming e-mails are not screened for response deadlines. The integrity and security of this message cannot be guaranteed on the Internet.



Art Adams
 

Andrew, I can’t answer that as I don’t know that camera well enough, or at all really. I do know that black shading will often solve that issue in other cameras. Sorry!

 

-Art

 

_______________________________________________________
Art 
Adams
Cinema Lens Specialist
ARRI Inc.
3700 Vanowen Street
BurbankCA 91505
www.arri.com 

818-841-7070
x4212
 
aadams@...

Get all the latest information from www.arri.comFacebookTwitterInstagram and YouTube.






This message is confidential. It may also be privileged or otherwise protected by work product immunity or other legal rules. If you have received it by mistake, please let us know by e-mail reply and delete it from your system; you may not copy this message or disclose its contents to anyone. Please send us by fax any message containing deadlines as incoming e-mails are not screened for response deadlines. The integrity and security of this message cannot be guaranteed on the Internet.


From: cml-raw-log-hdr@... <cml-raw-log-hdr@...> on behalf of Andrew Boulter via cml.news <andrew=andrewboulter.com@...>
Date: Thursday, April 1, 2021 at 12:32 PM
To: cml-raw-log-hdr@... <cml-raw-log-hdr@...>
Subject: Re: [cml-raw-log-hdr] Wave-Freefly Hi Speed Camera

Thankyou Art, 

 

So my next question is would black shading solve the problem I am seeing, and is that something a firmware update can cure, or not…….?  

 

Andrew

 

Andrew Boulter

Director of Photography

UK based but thanks to Covid, currently in Dubai for the foreseeable

+447768877686

+971585047839



On 1 Apr 2021, at 20:20, Art Adams <aadams@...> wrote:

 

Hi Andrew-

 

You’re thinking about black shading, not black balance. Black balance will just make sure black is black. Black shading is about eliminating noise and fixed patterns.

 

-Art

 

 

This message is confidential. It may also be privileged or otherwise protected by work product immunity or other legal rules. If you have received it by mistake, please let us know by e-mail reply and delete it from your system; you may not copy this message or disclose its contents to anyone. Please send us by fax any message containing deadlines as incoming e-mails are not screened for response deadlines. The integrity and security of this message cannot be guaranteed on the Internet.

_______________________________________________________

Art

 

Adams

Cinema Lens Specialist

ARRI Inc.

3700 Vanowen Street

Burbank

CA

 

91505

www.arri.com 

<image458551.png>

818-841-7070

x4212

 

<image888287.png>

aadams@...

Get all the latest information from www.arri.comFacebookTwitterInstagram and YouTube.





This message is confidential. It may also be privileged or otherwise protected by work product immunity or other legal rules. If you have received it by mistake, please let us know by e-mail reply and delete it from your system; you may not copy this message or disclose its contents to anyone. Please send us by fax any message containing deadlines as incoming e-mails are not screened for response deadlines. The integrity and security of this message cannot be guaranteed on the Internet.

From: cml-raw-log-hdr@... <cml-raw-log-hdr@...> on behalf of Andrew Boulter via cml.news <andrew=andrewboulter.com@...>
Date: Thursday, April 1, 2021 at 12:06 PM
To: cml-raw-log-hdr@... <cml-raw-log-hdr@...>
Subject: Re: [cml-raw-log-hdr] Wave-Freefly Hi Speed Camera

Yes, sorry about the examples, they are not great, here’s one more, I have increased the brightness and raised the shadow areas just to so you can see the pattern.  I hasten to add this is only to see the lines, forget the colours etc.  One of my thoughts was that its to do with a black balance, which isn’t possible, I then thought perhaps the temperature of the sensor might be an issue, I know when shooting Phantom some techs have told me they want the camera to ‘warm up”  

 

My main question is , what is producing the pattern, obviously the sensor, but what part of it and why?

 

<image001.jpg>

 

 

Andrew Boulter

Director of Photography

UK based but thanks to Covid, currently in Dubai for the foreseeable

+447768877686

+971585047839




On 1 Apr 2021, at 19:25, Colin Elves <colin@...> wrote:

 

I agree 100% with Alister: the frames are too small to judge (😃) but my initial assumption would be that it’s fixed pattern noise. Most cameras address this with a black balance. If that’s not an option here you’ll need to do it in post. 

Colin Elves
Director of Photography
Back in Brussels

On 1 Apr 2021, at 20:10, Andrew Boulter <andrew@...> wrote:

Thanks Alister, seems I forgot to mention one important thing, it was lit with sunlight alone, so its not that.

Andrew

 

 

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Cynthia Brett Webster
 

Would shooting through IRND Filters help to even out the blacks reaching the sensor?

Cynthia Webster DP
Los Angeles
818-524-9773

On Thu, Apr 1, 2021, 12:21 PM Art Adams <aadams@... wrote:

Hi Andrew-

 

You’re thinking about black shading, not black balance. Black balance will just make sure black is black. Black shading is about eliminating noise and fixed patterns.

 

-Art

 

_______________________________________________________
Art 
Adams
Cinema Lens Specialist
ARRI Inc.
3700 Vanowen Street
BurbankCA 91505
www.arri.com 

818-841-7070
x4212
 
aadams@...

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From: cml-raw-log-hdr@... <cml-raw-log-hdr@...> on behalf of Andrew Boulter via cml.news <andrew=andrewboulter.com@...>
Date: Thursday, April 1, 2021 at 12:06 PM
To: cml-raw-log-hdr@... <cml-raw-log-hdr@...>
Subject: Re: [cml-raw-log-hdr] Wave-Freefly Hi Speed Camera

Yes, sorry about the examples, they are not great, here’s one more, I have increased the brightness and raised the shadow areas just to so you can see the pattern.  I hasten to add this is only to see the lines, forget the colours etc.  One of my thoughts was that its to do with a black balance, which isn’t possible, I then thought perhaps the temperature of the sensor might be an issue, I know when shooting Phantom some techs have told me they want the camera to ‘warm up”  

 

My main question is , what is producing the pattern, obviously the sensor, but what part of it and why?

 

 

 

Andrew Boulter

Director of Photography

UK based but thanks to Covid, currently in Dubai for the foreseeable

+447768877686

+971585047839



On 1 Apr 2021, at 19:25, Colin Elves <colin@...> wrote:

 

I agree 100% with Alister: the frames are too small to judge (😃) but my initial assumption would be that it’s fixed pattern noise. Most cameras address this with a black balance. If that’s not an option here you’ll need to do it in post.

Colin Elves
Director of Photography
Back in Brussels

On 1 Apr 2021, at 20:10, Andrew Boulter <andrew@...> wrote:

Thanks Alister, seems I forgot to mention one important thing, it was lit with sunlight alone, so its not that.

Andrew

 

 

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Andrew Hunter
 

Hey Andrew,

The sample images you posted look like fixed pattern noise to me, BMD had similar issues with their 1st 4k camera when I recieved it.  Black shading is of course easier for everyone (production and post) when applied in camera but can be done after the fact.

The steps I've used in the past are as follows:

  1. Record about 2-3 minutes with the port cap on.
  2. Make sure that you are doing all your math with a linear oetf in the compositing app of your choice or the math just won't work right. 
  3. Average out the dark frames. (eg ADD all frames then DIVIDE by the number of frames)
  4. SUBTRACT the averaged dark frame from each frame of footage. 
It's cumbersome and much better when done in camera, but it is a method of salvaging shots when either a black shade wasn't done or was done incorrectly. 

My recollections from working with the Phantom HD Golds of yesteryear was the phantom tech would blackshade everytime we changed frame rate.

Sincerely,
Andrew Hunter
1st AC/ Sometimes DP+workflow janitor
Toronto, Canada

On Thu, Apr 1, 2021 at 3:29 PM Andrew Boulter <andrew@...> wrote:
Thankyou Art, 

So my next question is would black shading solve the problem I am seeing, and is that something a firmware update can cure, or not…….?  

Andrew

Andrew Boulter
Director of Photography
UK based but thanks to Covid, currently in Dubai for the foreseeable
+447768877686
+971585047839

On 1 Apr 2021, at 20:20, Art Adams <aadams@...> wrote:

Hi Andrew-
 
You’re thinking about black shading, not black balance. Black balance will just make sure black is black. Black shading is about eliminating noise and fixed patterns.
 
-Art
 
_______________________________________________________
Art 
Adams
Cinema Lens Specialist
ARRI Inc.
3700 Vanowen Street
BurbankCA 91505
www.arri.com 

<image458551.png>
818-841-7070
x4212
 
<image888287.png>
aadams@...

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From: cml-raw-log-hdr@... <cml-raw-log-hdr@...> on behalf of Andrew Boulter via cml.news <andrew=andrewboulter.com@...>
Date: Thursday, April 1, 2021 at 12:06 PM
To: cml-raw-log-hdr@... <cml-raw-log-hdr@...>
Subject: Re: [cml-raw-log-hdr] Wave-Freefly Hi Speed Camera

Yes, sorry about the examples, they are not great, here’s one more, I have increased the brightness and raised the shadow areas just to so you can see the pattern.  I hasten to add this is only to see the lines, forget the colours etc.  One of my thoughts was that its to do with a black balance, which isn’t possible, I then thought perhaps the temperature of the sensor might be an issue, I know when shooting Phantom some techs have told me they want the camera to ‘warm up”  
 
My main question is , what is producing the pattern, obviously the sensor, but what part of it and why?
 
<image001.jpg>
 
 
Andrew Boulter
Director of Photography
UK based but thanks to Covid, currently in Dubai for the foreseeable
+447768877686
+971585047839


On 1 Apr 2021, at 19:25, Colin Elves <colin@...> wrote:
 

I agree 100% with Alister: the frames are too small to judge (😃) but my initial assumption would be that it’s fixed pattern noise. Most cameras address this with a black balance. If that’s not an option here you’ll need to do it in post. 

Colin Elves
Director of Photography
Back in Brussels

On 1 Apr 2021, at 20:10, Andrew Boulter <andrew@...> wrote:

Thanks Alister, seems I forgot to mention one important thing, it was lit with sunlight alone, so its not that.

Andrew
 
 

This message is confidential. It may also be privileged or otherwise protected by work product immunity or other legal rules. If you have received it by mistake, please let us know by e-mail reply and delete it from your system; you may not copy this message or disclose its contents to anyone. Please send us by fax any message containing deadlines as incoming e-mails are not screened for response deadlines. The integrity and security of this message cannot be guaranteed on the Internet.





Art Adams
 

Hi Cynthia-

 

If there’s enough IR pollution then yes, the blacks would be contaminated along with everything else. At lower levels only fabrics and certain materials will noticeably change color.

 

In this case, as Andrew Hunter points out, it’s probably fixed pattern noise, so an IRND wouldn’t help.

 

Generally, though, a filter is going to affect all the light reaching the sensor, so anything that it does to the shadows will also be done to the highlights.

 

-Art

 

_______________________________________________________
Art 
Adams
Cinema Lens Specialist
ARRI Inc.
3700 Vanowen Street
BurbankCA 91505
www.arri.com 

818-841-7070
x4212
 
aadams@...

Get all the latest information from www.arri.comFacebookTwitterInstagram and YouTube.






This message is confidential. It may also be privileged or otherwise protected by work product immunity or other legal rules. If you have received it by mistake, please let us know by e-mail reply and delete it from your system; you may not copy this message or disclose its contents to anyone. Please send us by fax any message containing deadlines as incoming e-mails are not screened for response deadlines. The integrity and security of this message cannot be guaranteed on the Internet.


From: cml-raw-log-hdr@... <cml-raw-log-hdr@...> on behalf of Cynthia Brett Webster via cml.news <cyndustries.mail=gmail.com@...>
Date: Thursday, April 1, 2021 at 11:54 PM
To: cml-raw-log-hdr@... <cml-raw-log-hdr@...>
Subject: Re: [cml-raw-log-hdr] Wave-Freefly Hi Speed Camera

Would shooting through IRND Filters help to even out the blacks reaching the sensor?

 

Cynthia Webster DP

Los Angeles

818-524-9773

 

This message is confidential. It may also be privileged or otherwise protected by work product immunity or other legal rules. If you have received it by mistake, please let us know by e-mail reply and delete it from your system; you may not copy this message or disclose its contents to anyone. Please send us by fax any message containing deadlines as incoming e-mails are not screened for response deadlines. The integrity and security of this message cannot be guaranteed on the Internet.

On Thu, Apr 1, 2021, 12:21 PM Art Adams <aadams@... wrote:

Hi Andrew-

 

You’re thinking about black shading, not black balance. Black balance will just make sure black is black. Black shading is about eliminating noise and fixed patterns.

 

-Art

 

_______________________________________________________

Art

 

Adams

Cinema Lens Specialist

ARRI Inc.

3700 Vanowen Street

Burbank

CA

 

91505

www.arri.com 

818-841-7070

x4212

 

aadams@...

Get all the latest information from www.arri.comFacebookTwitterInstagram and YouTube.





This message is confidential. It may also be privileged or otherwise protected by work product immunity or other legal rules. If you have received it by mistake, please let us know by e-mail reply and delete it from your system; you may not copy this message or disclose its contents to anyone. Please send us by fax any message containing deadlines as incoming e-mails are not screened for response deadlines. The integrity and security of this message cannot be guaranteed on the Internet.

From: cml-raw-log-hdr@... <cml-raw-log-hdr@...> on behalf of Andrew Boulter via cml.news <andrew=andrewboulter.com@...>
Date: Thursday, April 1, 2021 at 12:06 PM
To: cml-raw-log-hdr@... <cml-raw-log-hdr@...>
Subject: Re: [cml-raw-log-hdr] Wave-Freefly Hi Speed Camera

Yes, sorry about the examples, they are not great, here’s one more, I have increased the brightness and raised the shadow areas just to so you can see the pattern.  I hasten to add this is only to see the lines, forget the colours etc.  One of my thoughts was that its to do with a black balance, which isn’t possible, I then thought perhaps the temperature of the sensor might be an issue, I know when shooting Phantom some techs have told me they want the camera to ‘warm up”  

 

My main question is , what is producing the pattern, obviously the sensor, but what part of it and why?

 

 

 

Andrew Boulter

Director of Photography

UK based but thanks to Covid, currently in Dubai for the foreseeable

+447768877686

+971585047839

 

On 1 Apr 2021, at 19:25, Colin Elves <colin@...> wrote:

 

I agree 100% with Alister: the frames are too small to judge (😃) but my initial assumption would be that it’s fixed pattern noise. Most cameras address this with a black balance. If that’s not an option here you’ll need to do it in post.

Colin Elves
Director of Photography
Back in Brussels

On 1 Apr 2021, at 20:10, Andrew Boulter <andrew@...> wrote:

Thanks Alister, seems I forgot to mention one important thing, it was lit with sunlight alone, so its not that.

Andrew

 

 

This message is confidential. It may also be privileged or otherwise protected by work product immunity or other legal rules. If you have received it by mistake, please let us know by e-mail reply and delete it from your system; you may not copy this message or disclose its contents to anyone. Please send us by fax any message containing deadlines as incoming e-mails are not screened for response deadlines. The integrity and security of this message cannot be guaranteed on the Internet.


Rakesh Malik
 

To be honest, I'd guess that you might be dealing with nothing more complicated than under-exposure here. It's a common thing in slow motion footage from people who haven't tried it, because it's easy to underestimate the difference in shutter speeds. You're looking at 1/800th of a second (1/1600th if you're using a 180 degree shutter), which is a huge difference from the standard 1/48 of a second. 

Plus, the areas in direct sunlight aren't showing the fixed pattern noise, which reinforces my theory that you're seeing underexposure. 

Rakesh Malik
DoP/Colourist, Vancouver, BC


-----------------------------


On Fri, Apr 2, 2021 at 8:32 AM Art Adams <aadams@...> wrote:

Hi Cynthia-

 

If there’s enough IR pollution then yes, the blacks would be contaminated along with everything else. At lower levels only fabrics and certain materials will noticeably change color.

 

In this case, as Andrew Hunter points out, it’s probably fixed pattern noise, so an IRND wouldn’t help.

 

Generally, though, a filter is going to affect all the light reaching the sensor, so anything that it does to the shadows will also be done to the highlights.

 

-Art

 

_______________________________________________________
Art 
Adams
Cinema Lens Specialist
ARRI Inc.
3700 Vanowen Street
BurbankCA 91505
www.arri.com 

818-841-7070
x4212
 
aadams@...

Get all the latest information from www.arri.comFacebookTwitterInstagram and YouTube.






This message is confidential. It may also be privileged or otherwise protected by work product immunity or other legal rules. If you have received it by mistake, please let us know by e-mail reply and delete it from your system; you may not copy this message or disclose its contents to anyone. Please send us by fax any message containing deadlines as incoming e-mails are not screened for response deadlines. The integrity and security of this message cannot be guaranteed on the Internet.


From: cml-raw-log-hdr@... <cml-raw-log-hdr@...> on behalf of Cynthia Brett Webster via cml.news <cyndustries.mail=gmail.com@...>
Date: Thursday, April 1, 2021 at 11:54 PM
To: cml-raw-log-hdr@... <cml-raw-log-hdr@...>
Subject: Re: [cml-raw-log-hdr] Wave-Freefly Hi Speed Camera

Would shooting through IRND Filters help to even out the blacks reaching the sensor?

 

Cynthia Webster DP

Los Angeles

818-524-9773

 

This message is confidential. It may also be privileged or otherwise protected by work product immunity or other legal rules. If you have received it by mistake, please let us know by e-mail reply and delete it from your system; you may not copy this message or disclose its contents to anyone. Please send us by fax any message containing deadlines as incoming e-mails are not screened for response deadlines. The integrity and security of this message cannot be guaranteed on the Internet.

On Thu, Apr 1, 2021, 12:21 PM Art Adams <aadams@... wrote:

Hi Andrew-

 

You’re thinking about black shading, not black balance. Black balance will just make sure black is black. Black shading is about eliminating noise and fixed patterns.

 

-Art

 

_______________________________________________________

Art

 

Adams

Cinema Lens Specialist

ARRI Inc.

3700 Vanowen Street

Burbank

CA

 

91505

www.arri.com 

818-841-7070

x4212

 

aadams@...

Get all the latest information from www.arri.comFacebookTwitterInstagram and YouTube.





This message is confidential. It may also be privileged or otherwise protected by work product immunity or other legal rules. If you have received it by mistake, please let us know by e-mail reply and delete it from your system; you may not copy this message or disclose its contents to anyone. Please send us by fax any message containing deadlines as incoming e-mails are not screened for response deadlines. The integrity and security of this message cannot be guaranteed on the Internet.

From: cml-raw-log-hdr@... <cml-raw-log-hdr@...> on behalf of Andrew Boulter via cml.news <andrew=andrewboulter.com@...>
Date: Thursday, April 1, 2021 at 12:06 PM
To: cml-raw-log-hdr@... <cml-raw-log-hdr@...>
Subject: Re: [cml-raw-log-hdr] Wave-Freefly Hi Speed Camera

Yes, sorry about the examples, they are not great, here’s one more, I have increased the brightness and raised the shadow areas just to so you can see the pattern.  I hasten to add this is only to see the lines, forget the colours etc.  One of my thoughts was that its to do with a black balance, which isn’t possible, I then thought perhaps the temperature of the sensor might be an issue, I know when shooting Phantom some techs have told me they want the camera to ‘warm up”  

 

My main question is , what is producing the pattern, obviously the sensor, but what part of it and why?

 

 

 

Andrew Boulter

Director of Photography

UK based but thanks to Covid, currently in Dubai for the foreseeable

+447768877686

+971585047839

 

On 1 Apr 2021, at 19:25, Colin Elves <colin@...> wrote:

 

I agree 100% with Alister: the frames are too small to judge (😃) but my initial assumption would be that it’s fixed pattern noise. Most cameras address this with a black balance. If that’s not an option here you’ll need to do it in post.

Colin Elves
Director of Photography
Back in Brussels

On 1 Apr 2021, at 20:10, Andrew Boulter <andrew@...> wrote:

Thanks Alister, seems I forgot to mention one important thing, it was lit with sunlight alone, so its not that.

Andrew

 

 

This message is confidential. It may also be privileged or otherwise protected by work product immunity or other legal rules. If you have received it by mistake, please let us know by e-mail reply and delete it from your system; you may not copy this message or disclose its contents to anyone. Please send us by fax any message containing deadlines as incoming e-mails are not screened for response deadlines. The integrity and security of this message cannot be guaranteed on the Internet.


Andrew Boulter
 

Hi, 

thank you everyone for your answers, the “fixed pattern noise” seems to be the best description of the issue, I am going to contact Wave Freefly direct and see if they can tell me anymore, or if they are hoping to solve it with firmware update.

I don’t really agree with you Rakesh as the exposure set is correct for the hi lights from the water and the stone in direct sunlight, when doing this test I made sure that there was a significant amount of shadow so it was easy to see what issues, if any, might be.  Dynamic range historically has always been a thing with any of the high speed cameras, do you remember the Weissman 1 !  Its the first thing I look for, its not great on this camera, but not that bad, considering the $10K price point.  I really want to like this, having a highspeed/slowmo camera on car shoots is super useful, especially if its cheap to rent.

For the moment the lines issue that I see in the shadows means this one, as it stands is unusable.

Thankyou to Andrew Hunter for the work around, seems they really need to make this happen incamera.

Andrew

Andrew Boulter
Director of Photography
UK based but thanks to Covid, currently in Dubai for the foreseeable
+447768877686
+971585047839

On 2 Apr 2021, at 16:46, Rakesh Malik <tamerlin@...> wrote:

To be honest, I'd guess that you might be dealing with nothing more complicated than under-exposure here. It's a common thing in slow motion footage from people who haven't tried it, because it's easy to underestimate the difference in shutter speeds. You're looking at 1/800th of a second (1/1600th if you're using a 180 degree shutter), which is a huge difference from the standard 1/48 of a second. 

Plus, the areas in direct sunlight aren't showing the fixed pattern noise, which reinforces my theory that you're seeing underexposure. 

Rakesh Malik
DoP/Colourist, Vancouver, BC


-----------------------------


On Fri, Apr 2, 2021 at 8:32 AM Art Adams <aadams@...> wrote:

Hi Cynthia-

 

If there’s enough IR pollution then yes, the blacks would be contaminated along with everything else. At lower levels only fabrics and certain materials will noticeably change color.

 

In this case, as Andrew Hunter points out, it’s probably fixed pattern noise, so an IRND wouldn’t help.

 

Generally, though, a filter is going to affect all the light reaching the sensor, so anything that it does to the shadows will also be done to the highlights.

 

-Art

 

_______________________________________________________
Art 
Adams
Cinema Lens Specialist
ARRI Inc.
3700 Vanowen Street
BurbankCA 91505
www.arri.com 

<image588541.png>
818-841-7070
x4212
 
<image374425.png>
aadams@...

Get all the latest information from www.arri.comFacebookTwitterInstagram and YouTube.






This message is confidential. It may also be privileged or otherwise protected by work product immunity or other legal rules. If you have received it by mistake, please let us know by e-mail reply and delete it from your system; you may not copy this message or disclose its contents to anyone. Please send us by fax any message containing deadlines as incoming e-mails are not screened for response deadlines. The integrity and security of this message cannot be guaranteed on the Internet.


From: cml-raw-log-hdr@... <cml-raw-log-hdr@...> on behalf of Cynthia Brett Webster via cml.news <cyndustries.mail=gmail.com@...>
Date: Thursday, April 1, 2021 at 11:54 PM
To: cml-raw-log-hdr@... <cml-raw-log-hdr@...>
Subject: Re: [cml-raw-log-hdr] Wave-Freefly Hi Speed Camera

Would shooting through IRND Filters help to even out the blacks reaching the sensor?

 

Cynthia Webster DP

Los Angeles

818-524-9773

 

This message is confidential. It may also be privileged or otherwise protected by work product immunity or other legal rules. If you have received it by mistake, please let us know by e-mail reply and delete it from your system; you may not copy this message or disclose its contents to anyone. Please send us by fax any message containing deadlines as incoming e-mails are not screened for response deadlines. The integrity and security of this message cannot be guaranteed on the Internet.

On Thu, Apr 1, 2021, 12:21 PM Art Adams <aadams@... wrote:

Hi Andrew-

 

You’re thinking about black shading, not black balance. Black balance will just make sure black is black. Black shading is about eliminating noise and fixed patterns.

 

-Art

 

_______________________________________________________

Art

 

Adams

Cinema Lens Specialist

ARRI Inc.

3700 Vanowen Street

Burbank

CA

 

91505

www.arri.com 

818-841-7070

x4212

 

aadams@...

Get all the latest information from www.arri.comFacebookTwitterInstagram and YouTube.





This message is confidential. It may also be privileged or otherwise protected by work product immunity or other legal rules. If you have received it by mistake, please let us know by e-mail reply and delete it from your system; you may not copy this message or disclose its contents to anyone. Please send us by fax any message containing deadlines as incoming e-mails are not screened for response deadlines. The integrity and security of this message cannot be guaranteed on the Internet.

From: cml-raw-log-hdr@... <cml-raw-log-hdr@...> on behalf of Andrew Boulter via cml.news <andrew=andrewboulter.com@...>
Date: Thursday, April 1, 2021 at 12:06 PM
To: cml-raw-log-hdr@... <cml-raw-log-hdr@...>
Subject: Re: [cml-raw-log-hdr] Wave-Freefly Hi Speed Camera

Yes, sorry about the examples, they are not great, here’s one more, I have increased the brightness and raised the shadow areas just to so you can see the pattern.  I hasten to add this is only to see the lines, forget the colours etc.  One of my thoughts was that its to do with a black balance, which isn’t possible, I then thought perhaps the temperature of the sensor might be an issue, I know when shooting Phantom some techs have told me they want the camera to ‘warm up”  

 

My main question is , what is producing the pattern, obviously the sensor, but what part of it and why?

 

 
 

Andrew Boulter

Director of Photography

UK based but thanks to Covid, currently in Dubai for the foreseeable

+447768877686

+971585047839

 

On 1 Apr 2021, at 19:25, Colin Elves <colin@...> wrote:

 

I agree 100% with Alister: the frames are too small to judge (😃) but my initial assumption would be that it’s fixed pattern noise. Most cameras address this with a black balance. If that’s not an option here you’ll need to do it in post.

Colin Elves
Director of Photography
Back in Brussels

On 1 Apr 2021, at 20:10, Andrew Boulter <andrew@...> wrote:

Thanks Alister, seems I forgot to mention one important thing, it was lit with sunlight alone, so its not that.

Andrew

 
 

This message is confidential. It may also be privileged or otherwise protected by work product immunity or other legal rules. If you have received it by mistake, please let us know by e-mail reply and delete it from your system; you may not copy this message or disclose its contents to anyone. Please send us by fax any message containing deadlines as incoming e-mails are not screened for response deadlines. The integrity and security of this message cannot be guaranteed on the Internet.





Barry Bassett
 

We noticed lines on our test recordings too and this is why we rejected the Wave camera.

 

Barry Bassett

London rental company, VMI


Bob Kertesz
 

Would shooting through IRND Filters help to even out the blacks reaching the sensor?

Cynthia Webster DP


Yes, if there's actual IR present. Even when subtle (and depending on the camera/lens/sensor), the changed blacks are the first thing I notice when IR is present, as they usually tend to go a brownish/reddish color on camera.

But it also depends on the material doing the reflecting. I once shot a promo with a four person Mariachi band all wearing tuxedos. All the tuxes looked black to the naked eye, but depending on the material used, they went different colors on camera from subtle browns to subtle greens. The only one that remained black was the one that seemed to be made with cotton. 100% cotton seems to absorb the IR and not reflect it back into the lens.

It has been my experience that a well used all cotton flag shoved in front of the camera can often be used as a 'standard', since unless the IR is wildly out of control (shooting outside in bright sunlight with a ton of non-IR coated NDs), it will remain black in the presence of moderate IR. I used to use that trick to answer the question of "Why are the blacks different colors? What's wrong with your camera?" If the flag stayed black, the answer was "Nothing at all."

-Bob

Bob Kertesz
BlueScreen LLC
Hollywood, California

Mostly Retired Engineer, Video Controller, and Live Compositor Extraordinaire.

High quality images for almost five decades - whether you've wanted them or not.©

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